Date: Thu, 11 Apr 1996 19:25:05 -0400
From: NCreed@aol.com
To: 102125.3126@compuserve.com, 103450.3521@compuserve.com,
72650.74@compuserve.com, ahunter@freenet.vcu.edu, ALABAMA233@aol.com,
BKeys26433@aol.com, BLACK@globe.com, burnett@kaizen.net,
cdorian@accessone.com, cgaunt@umich.edu, ChickFlet@aol.com,
chlamy@acpub.duke.edu, CHRISTIEFC@aol.com, connie.spaw@cbis.com,
CW1210@aol.com, davidcon@microsoft.com, dfullam@albany.net,
DP6195@aol.com, ekirkman@swva.net, hoffman@gate.net,
IRXP500@indyvax.iupui.edu, jlampkin@selu.edu, JMarieCox@aol.com,
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marockem@minot.ndak.net, mcclaran@ionet.net, mlsaps@mcn.net,
N4JED@aol.com, NCreed@aol.com, Pat-Chesney@easy.com, PWhetzel@aol.com,
rhobson@sdcoe.k12.ca.us, ross@interramp.com, rsimms@math.clemson.edu,
shauck@d.umn.edu, turner@mind.net, waddiesalmon@usa.pipeline.com,
WittBates@aol.com, wjarrell@phoenix.phoenix.net
Subject: TURNER-BURNETT-VIA-ROSS-ETC/ETC COMPILATION #10
Hello to Everyone: 11 April 1996
Chris Gaunt has been faithfully adding our compilations to her
home page. This will be compilation number 10. If you haven't
checked out Chris' homepage lately, you'll find something new. A
search of all our compilations. Hopefully, we'll hear from more
folks researching our lines as a result of the TURNER-BURNETT-
VIA-ROSS-ETC/ETC information that Chris is maintaining.
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~cgaunt/etc/etc.html
Again. Thanks for sharing your information. I'm convinced we'll
all benefit by this exchange.
Nyla Creed DePauk
Vienna VA
=========================================
Subj: Turners on Mayflower
Date: 96-04-05 09:30:23 EST
From: Pat-Chesney@easy.com (Pat Chesney)
Hi, Nyla and fellow Turner researchers.
Just wanted to follow up on Phillips comments about the
family of John Turner on the Mayflower. Yes, I knew that he and
his two sons died that first winter after arriving but in my
research to see why there would be so strong a story in my family
that we were related to this family I turned up some interesting
facts. The following one I just learned recently that this story
also appeared in another Turner family and was stated in a
magazine or book article long ago. My sister who has been doing
some research for me at the Austin library sent the following
several letters which I include but have taken this part out and
highlighted. This is an entirely different line coming down then
my Turners but has same story. I also found other information
that makes for the * possibility * of the story being true.
This article also states the possibility that the ****
tradition ****in one family is that the son or grandson of John
Turner, Mayflower Pilgrim,**** was one of the first settlers in
New Haven, Conn. His name was Nathaniel Turner
Other info I have found - John Turner was a widower before
the voyage. He brought two sons with him. Neither their age nor
their names are listed. I would assume they might have been
younger then 12 since they are not named and older then 4 yrs
since their father took them without a wife. A daughter comes
over later and marries but doesn't leave any children behind.
Could there have been other children left behind? If there were
other children left behind whose family would they have been put
in? I believe they would have been put with relatives that were
also of the Separatist belief.
Since John Turner may have come from the same place as
Brewster and the other pilgrims in England and also appears to
have gone to Leyden Holland, his family, including relatives of
same belief, would have been close to the Separatists that did
make it to the new world. I found that eight yrs after the
pilgrims arrived - a Humphrey Turner comes to Plymouth.
In one place it says he had several, maybe as many as four John
Turners in his household. He is listed in several places as
having two Johns for his first sons. That is very unusual and
they are pretty far apart in age not just a few yrs. They
obviously grew up together because one is called John the eldar
to differentiate him from his younger brother - John the younger.
This older John marries into the most important family in
Plymouth - William Brewsters - marrying his granddaughter Mary
Brewster. For this to happen means the family was well recieved
by the Brewsters - one with them in their beliefs and possibly
well known by the Brewsters before they came to the new world. To
find that this Humphrey Turner's descendants, in more then just
my family line, claim to be related to the Turners on the
Mayflower, makes me feel like there is a possiblity that Humphrey
could have been related to the Turners that came over eight yrs
before and died that first winter. Perhaps he even had one of
John's sons with his family or was someway related. Humphrey also
named a son Nathaniel. So the Nathaniel mentioned that says he
was descendant of the John Turner on the Mayflower might possibly
be related to the Humphrey Turner family in some way also.
Remember how few Separatists there were in England and how
they would have clung together if their family were in the same
church. I believe there is a possibility that John Turner on the
Mayflower might have left another child behind besides his
daughter and that child might have been raised by a relative. Or
that John Turner on the Mayflower might have had relatives that
came a few yrs later and claimed to be related or descendants of
that Turner family on the Mayflower. Or the story could come
from the John Turner the eldest son of Humphrey marrying into
William Brewsters family and claiming they were from Mayflower
people - but the story in my family and in that other is that
they are descendants of the John Turner on the Mayflower!!
If any other Turner researchers have anything to add along
these lines I am obviously interested. My William S. Turner told
this story to his family and it was passed down in writing and by
word of mouth. Also the part about being related to James Turner
the governor of NC. I found that information to be true so gives
me hope for the other being true also. But I do know that no one
has ever been able to prove it. Perhaps as more people research
this Mayflower group new research will turn up more information
that might help understand the relationships between the people
back in England and their family lines. So if anyone has anything
or knows of a good source to search let me know!
On with what my sister sent me -
If you can find the book, Signers of the Mayflower Compact,
the article is on page 22 and is quite informative. You do know
that a John Turner married Mary Brewster Nov. 12, 1645. This may
be where the confusion is coming from about the Brewster line.
This John Turner's father was Humphrey Turner of Scituate.
One book we found even said that his wife had come with him
on the Mayflower, but that is hard to believe with no listing of
her on the passenger list, even if whe died on the trip over.
They do give the neme of the town he came from before the trip,
being Leyden, Holland of the Netherlands. We forgot to write
down the name of the book that we got this info. out of, but will
try to find it the next time we go. This is what was written:
John Turner with wife and 2 sons came to Plymouth and are classed
with the Leyden contingent. All died in the first winter, but a
daughter came some years after to Salem and married
there.(Bradford) Her identity has not been established.
I INSERT HERE A LATER BIT OF INFORMATION
We did find a treasure. One book showed the name of his
daughter (Signers of the Mayflower Compact)as Marjorie who
married the first Richard Paul in 1638. They place her in Salem,
Mass. This article also states the possibility that the ****
tradition ****in one family is that the son or grandson of John
Turner, Mayflower Pilgrim,**** was one of the first settlers in
New Haven, Conn. His name was Nathaniel Turner. One of
descendants, a first settler of Hartford, Conn.-from there John
Turner also a descendant-went to Norfolk, Conn. and was one of
the first settlers there about 1758.
In connection with the above, there is some Pilgrim evidence
in the fact that the Windsor, Conn., Browns who are supposed to
descend from Peter Brown, went as was natural under such
circumstances, to Hartford and Norfolk, Conn., as well, with the
Turners. The authors attention was called to "Historical
Collections of Grantham, England," by Edward Tunour, Grantham,
southwestern part of Lincolnshire. More to come.
In 1592 a John Turner sold a messuage in Doncaster to
William Bradforth and it is probable that the Mayflower Pilgrim
was of the original Pilgrim band in 1610 emigrating to Leyden
with Bradford and Brewster. John Turner, a merchant, was
admitted burgess of Leyden that year.
A John Turner was married at Whitechapel in 1615, where
later Stephen Hopkins took a second wife. Several persons
connected with the Pilgrims lived in that parish. end. This
could be him if it was a second marriage. In another book it
said that the children with no names given on the roster
were under the age of 20.
The James Turner that was Gov. and Senator of No. Carolina
was stated as being a cousin of our Turners. Maybe William's
cousin? There will be much written about him in No. Carolina
history, but maybe someone already has his line done. He was
born in Southampton Co., VA on Dec. 20, 1766. When very young
his father moved them to Warren (then Bute)Co., Nor. Carolina.
Well I have written all I have time for now, but if I
remember any other stuff we found I will write you again later.
We may go somewhere today and tomorrow, so look for me on Sat.
maybe. But go ahead and send me mail as soon as you want, our
plans may fall through.
After reading your letter on James Turner's line, I looked
back at the article I had told you about and found it mentioned
Humphrey Turner there also. So I want to type more of it and let
you read it for yourself and see if you can make any since of it.
There are some discrepencies that occur according to your info,
so I don't know which is the more reliable source.
Here it is: The Turner name certainly carries with it the
Brewster record, and as the various marriages make as many lines,
I give it in the chart as sent to me: Humphrey Turner, died
1673; was of Scituate, Mass., in 1633. Married Lydia Garner.
Their eldest son, John Turner, born in Eng. Nov. 12, 1645,
married Mary Brewster, daughter of Jonathan Brewster and
Lucretia, granddaughter of Elder William Brewster.
Benjamin Turner, born March 5, 1650, died April 14, 1692,
married Elizabeth Hawkins.
Capt. Hawkins Turner, born Aug. 24,1704, in Scituate, Mass.,
married Lucy Starr, of New London, Conn., born July 18, 1707,
died Mar. 16, 1809.
Jonathan Starr, of New London, Conn., married daughter of
Elizabeth Morgan, of Groton, Conn.
Samuel Starr, son of Comfort Starr, married Hannah Brewster,
daughter of Jonathan Brewster and Lucretia, granddaughter of
Elder William Brewster.
Many notes come to me from all quarters in regard to the
Turner family. All will be useful to future historian. My
attention was called to "Historical Collections of Grantham,
Engaland," by Edmund Turnour, Grantham, southwestern part of
Lincolnshire.
Although the present generation spell the name Turnour, it
seems from the book, to have been formerly Turnor or Turner. As
this place was near the vicintiy of the other Pilgrims, it seems
possible John Turner, of the Mayflower, may have come from here.
In Dr. Eggleston's "Beginners of a Nation," published in
1897, on page 130, is reference to a book of Dr. Bound's on a
stricter Sabbath. Page 139: "It is Thomas Rogers, the earliest
opponent of the doctrine of Greenham and Bound, etc. Preface to
Thirty-nine Articles, paragraph 20."
Can this be Thomas Rogers, of the Mayflower?
Mr. Alfred R. Turner, of Malden, Mass., who has stood
bravely by both Turners and Rogerses, as a lineal descendant,
sends the line of Humphrey Turner:
Humphrey Turner and wife Lydia came to Plymouth in 1628 and
settled in Scituate, near Coleman's Hills. They had John (1),
John(2), Thomas(3), Daniel(4), Nathaniel(5), Joseph(6), Lydia(7),
Mary(8).
John(1) married Mary Brewster, daughter of Jonathan
Brewster, and granddaughter to Elder William Brewster, Nov. 12,
1645. They had thirteen children.
Joseph who married Bathsheba Hobart, had Bathsheba,
Margaret.
Ezekiel, who married Susanna Keney, had Ezekeil, Grace,
Lucretia, Sarah, Ruth, Mary, Elizabeth, Lydia, Hannah, Susanna.
John, who married Abigail Padeshall, had Richard, Abiel, John,
Margaret, Lydia, Abigail.
Elisha who married Elizabeth Jacob, had Elisha, Mary, Jael,
Jane, Elizabeth, Mary.
Benjamin who married Elizabeth Hawkins, had John, Joseph,
Benjamin, William, Hawkins, Grace, Elizabeth.
Jonathan who married first Martha Bisbee, second, Mercy
Hatch, had Isaac, Ignatius, Jesse, Martha, Deborah, Keziah,
Jonathan, Mary, Jemima, Ruth.
Amos who married Mary Hiland, had Amos, Ezediel, Seth, Jane,
Mary, Lydia, Anna. I am not informed in regard to the rest -
Joseph, Lydia, Mary, Ruth, Isaac Grace.
THE ABOVE IS AN EXCERPT FROM THE BOOK "SIGNERS OF THE
MAYFLOWER COMPACT". PG. 22, JOHN TURNER, THE 22ND SIGNER.
====================================
Subj: BURNETT-TURNER-ROSS-VIA-
Date: 96-04-06 09:14:25 EST
From: 72650.74@compuserve.com (Philip A. Turner)
I am looking for the ancestors of a William Turner who married
a Tabitha Pruett. They both were born in Virginia in the 1780s
and later moved to Switzerland County, IN where they raised their
family and died.
Recently, it has occurred to me that WEST Virginia was part of
Virginia up until 1863. Is anyone out there researching the
Turner family in West Virginia. If so, I would like to
correspond with them.
Thanks
Philip Turner
=============================
Philip:
In a message dated 96-04-06 09:14:25 EST, you write:
>William Turner who married a Tabitha Pruett.
There were Pruetts in Tazewell County. Have you checked
that county at all? I'll add your message to the next mailing.
Have you tried Roots-L or WVA-L? Nyla
===============================
Subj: Burnett
Date: 96-04-09 16:46:34 EDT
From: ekirkman@swva.net (Eunice B. Kirkman)
File: FILE.RTF (15709 bytes)
DL Time (28800 bps): < 1 minute
Nyla,
Do place me on your mailing list. I have a large number of
surname files of the early pioneers of Patrick County, VA. Will
be glad to send the list to anyone requesting information of
Patrick County or Virginia ancestors. I am sending you, as an
attachment, some very early Burnett settlers. I don't know how
accurate the lineage is, however, if anyone seems familiar...
I'll see what else I can find.
One of my research focuses is on the Turner family. I have
some fairly well documented files on two early settlers here, I
think they were two distinct lines, that of James Turner, b. ca
1675-80 Augusta Co., VA, Baptist Minister, and Shadrach Turner,
b. ca 1680-90 origin unknown (most likely Scotland). These
branches do not match those you have. BUT the surnames that
mentioned in last transmit match with surnames found in my
files...VIA, BURNETT, TURNER, PHILPOTT, NOWLIN, LAWSON.
Thanks, Eunice Kirkman ekirkman@swva.net
===============================================================
NOTE: JUST REALIZED THAT I COULD NOT CONVERT THE FILE THAT
EUNICE KIRKMAN HAD ATTACHED. I WILL INCLUDE THAT WITH THE NEXT
MAILING IF POSSIBLE. NYLA
===========================
Subj: TURNER mailing list
Date: 96-04-09 09:35:42 EDT
From: marockem@minot.ndak.net
Please post with your TURNER mailing list, thanks. Looking
for more information on this family:
Lucinda TURNER b. 1866 in Jasper County (IL?)
d. 1906 buried rural Rosehill, IL cemetery
She married John Lee "Lee" CLINE in 1882, they had 8
children. She is the daughter of Chrisopher & Arminta (CUMMINS)
TURNER. (They are both buried east of Rose Hill, IL). She had a
sister, Jane, who is buried at rural Rose Hill, IL.
Any information would be appreciated. Thank you.
Annette (marockem@minot.ndak.net)
==========================================
Subj: Turner newsletter
Date: 96-04-10 13:40:03 EDT
From: Pat-Chesney@easy.com (Pat Chesney)
Hi, Nyla,
Just wanted to let everyone know on Turner newsletter that I
talked with my sister Jeanne last night and she found some
information that points to our William S. Turner being William
Suddarth Turner. So the following info that John Turner sent me
from his Turner family history book is what I am going
to pursue at this time.
Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 07:50:14 -0500
From: johnt@fhouse.org
Subject: Turner family
To: pat-chesney@easy.com
Hello again, Well I found another William, This is William
Suddarth Turner married Elizabeth P. Smith and moved to Texas His
father was John Turner Born in Virginia and died prior to 1820
and John father was Terisha Turner born 1705 probably England
settled in Amherst County, Virginia and married Sarah Wimpy.
I did find the Gov. James Turner he had three wifes Polly
Anderson (2)Ann Cochran and (3)Elizabeth Johnston.
The Book I am using is A History of the Turner Family by
William A. Roskey - American genealogical Research institute,
Washington D.C.
James was from the Mass. Line of Turner and that is where you
find the Brewsters. ***
Also - I'm still pursuing the connection with James Turner
the governor because of the statement that A.J. Sowell made in
his Texas INdian fighter book about his mother Mary Turner Sowell
saying James Turner the governor of NC was her great grandfather.
I do not find the dates of her father and James to indictate that
this is a true statement. But in reading in a book called TENN.
COUSINs I read that James Turner the governor had a mother or
grandmother that was also a Turner. So there could be a tie there
to a whole different Turner family line. In the family line of
James Turner or any other Turners connected in the Turner family
book there is not one Terisha Turner mentioned.
I did notice as I looked through the Turners in that book
trying to find Terisha's name some Gilbert girls marrying Turners
and naming their children Gilbert as a middle name. My William's
son Calvin Turner named his first born Gilbert Jackson Turner.
Also in talking with my sister Jeanne last night she read
out of Sowells book where my Major William S. Turner was on the
staff under Gen. Jackson. I didn't realize he was that close
connection. Said he was shot with arrors in head and neck during
the indian battles, and though wounded seriously survived. I need
to look for books covering Jacksons military compaigns I guess.
I wrote Jo after she sent me this note. Anyone know of
connections between any of these families mentioned? I know
there are some good family books on the Payne family. They might
document a side family. I know of some Payne researchers I could
write and ask.
From: Jogt@aol.com
Date: Fri, 22 Mar 1996 10:05:18 -0500
To: Pat-Chesney@easy.com
Subject: Turner, Terisha
I was just reading the compilation of Turner data on Chis
Gaunt's page. I saw that you listed Terisha Turner as an
ancestor. I wonder if you have any documentation of him before
the mid 1700s? I have a few references for his wife and her
family from Essex Co., but nothing pertaining to Terisha and her
getting married.
My line goes through James, s/o James, s/o Old Terisha.
James died in Sumner Co., TN - but I don't know exactly when.
His daughter, Eliz. married Simpson Payne there in 1824 and later
when her mother, Lucy Ham Turner died her estate gives to
"Simpson Payne, who married Eiz. the d/o the dec'd." several
slaves. Eliz. also named her daughter Lucy Ham Payne.
Convenient, huh?
Are you aware that Sumner Co., TN has great archives, and
will even do research for you?
Jo Thiessen jogt@aol.com
Thanks for any helps from Turner researchers.
Terri Chesney
Pat and Terri Chesney
Rt. 5 Box 895 E
Waco, Texas 76705
fax: (817)-829-0251
phone: (817)-829-0153
============================
Subj: TURNER family
Date: 96-04-07 15:24:53 EDT
From: IRXP500@INDYVAX.IUPUI.EDU (JEFFERY A. DUVALL)
I was given your name and e-mail address by Chris Gaunt, who
informed me that I might be able to get some help on a TURNER
family mystery that I am trying to solve. My gg-grandmother,
Mrs. Henrietta TURNER-BLEDSOE KEMPER, was born in Owen Co., KY.
Her mother was Mary Jane BLEDSOE and her father was Samuel
TURNER.
All I do know is that my gg-grandmother, Henrietta, was raised by
a great-aunt and uncle, Robert and Mary "Polly" KEMPER SLAUGHTER.
Jeff Duvall (irxp500@indyvax.iupui.edu)
920 E. Markwood Ave.
Apt. A10
Indpls., IN 46227
(317) 786-4507
=====================================
NOTE: I HAVE DELETED A PORTION OF MR. DUVALL'S MESSAGE. IF YOU
HAVE FURTHER INFORMATION ON Henrietta Turner-Bledsoe Kemper,
PLEASE GET IN TOUCH WITH HIM DIRECTLY. THANK YOU. NYLA
=====================================
Subj: Henrietta TURNER BLEDSOE KEMPER
Date: 96-04-07 23:02:42 EDT
From: IRXP500@INDYVAX.IUPUI.EDU (JEFFERY A. DUVALL)
Nyla,
Thanks for both your prompt reply to my "out-of-the-blue"
message and for the offer to help. I would be delited to have
you post an aol query (or whatever its called) and anything else
you are willing to do. If it is possible, you could just have
people send responses to me directly at my E-mail address rather
than having to forward them to me, but you no doubt know more
about the technology than I do--I am still at the "I'm so amazed
that I figured out how to send e-mail" stage.
Sorry about dropping off my gg-grandmother's dates--its been
a long weekend I guess. They are as follows:
Henrietta TURNER BLEDSOE was born in Poplar Grove, Owen Co.,
KY on 16-Dec-1846 and died in Louisville, KY on 14-Feb-1918. My
impression is that her time in Louisville was rather brief and
that she had been resident in Worthville, Carroll Co., KY for
most of the latter half of her life.
I am currently subscribed to the KYROOTS and VA-ROOTS
lists--I believe that Chris Gaunt wrote to me in response to a
posting that I ran on KYROOTS regarding Samuel TURNER. I am not
subscribed to the other ROOTS list that you mentioned, however.
Would you reccomend it?
Thanks for your help and feel free to ask any other
questions that you feel might be of any use in helping me to
pin-down just who Samuel TURNER was.
Jeff (irxp500@indyvax.iupui.edu)
I do have one other odd bit of info which might, or might
not, be of use: In the 1960s, a Mrs. Martha Reed Roberts of Ft.
Thomas, KY ran a couple of queries in the journal "Kentucky
Ancestors" in which she was seeking information on my
gg-grandmother Henrietta "Eddie/Etta" TURNER BLEDSOE and her
family. Unfortunately, I ran across these several decades too
late--I wrote the address but Mrs. Roberts was long gone--and
have wondered ever since who Mrs. Roberts was and why she was
trying to contact my family.
===========================
The end.